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Wesley Hoyle's avatar

I think it's easy to forget that students are rarely the ultimate culprits when it comes to the loan issue. How about the perverse incentives created by government overreach and an enforced narrative that "college is for everyone"? These hurt not only the financial wellbeing of students and society, but also the quality of the education itself, with so much monopoly money propping up useless postmodernist basket-weaving "academic" programs.

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Surviving the Billionaire Wars's avatar

Ty. I'm going to re-post what I posted yesterday. I'll add this:

it's immoral for the government to project job growth in fields that are shrinking; to select 'special" groups of people to attend school free of all expenses & are even paid to go to school, while loaning $$ at usurious rates to "nonspecial" others; to reward companies for hiring from the "special groups" first, shutting out the indebted students from working in the field they trained for; to outright lie about the salary ranges in those fields; and to import immigrants (who were trained for free by their own governments) to fill those jobs at lower wages than the indebted possibly can live on.

That is what happened and continues to happen. I would go do far as to say it is fraud; not only immoral but criminal.

Mary23 hr ago

I'm going to wade/weigh in here on student loans, because I see a lot of wrong assumptions & I have direct experience with my own student loans. I will be selling my home soon, in part to return to my prior debt free state.

1. college students are not automatically "privileged." The students I know were working class, attending community & state schools. Upper class, privileged students would not qualify for fafsa loans.

2. A fair number were middle aged, whose careers & jobs had disappeared out from under them, back around '08 when the economy started collapsing in earnest.

3. Most of us worked part time, went to school part time, but p/t work is no longer enough to cover school expenses, never mind live on. I was routinely putting in 18 hour days. I graduated summa cum laude.

4. The students I saw were going mostly into health care: nursing, lab tech, pharmacy, some young students with plans to go further.

5. The media had been proclaiming job growth in health care for years, with articles about doctors shortages, nursing shortages, etc.

6. Federal employment statistics showed 100% employment, with projected continuing job growth, in my field at 14%/year for the foreseeable future. I even checked Canada's #s and found similar stats.

6. Human Resources at the local hospital lied to me and to at least 2 other student about the starting salary & range for our field, inflating

the starting salary by some 30%.

7. In the meantime, the truly "privileged students" came from 2 groups: Somalian refugees, who went to school for free, all expenses paid, plus a living stipend. And union workers laid off from local mills, who went to school for free, all expenses paid, and continued to collect full salaries, even including contributions to iras, from their unions. One woman I know was actually collecting 2 salaries, her union-funded & part time phlebotomy at her local hospital, getting her foot in the door at the lab in advance.

8. The supposed shortage of health care workers was filled largely with immigrants. And my field was shrinking due to technology advance.

9. After years of grueling & expensive training, there ended up being far more medical students than internship positions. I saw a mother in some forum switch from complaining that her son's internship was far away to realizing he was lucky to get one at all. Medical students ended up forming a group & suing (I forget who) because the carnage was so bad.

20. Locally, the Somalian refugees & former union workers were the preferred new hires.

21. At graduation, roughly 50% of our class had not yet been able to even get job interviews. There were young people applying all over the country & getting zip.

22. I was in the half that was hired. Of roughly 25 of us, 1 was hired full time. The rest were p/t, per diem, 2-4 days/week. At wages considerably lower than I'd been deliberately & knowingly misled to believe.

So you can blame & punish the stupid, hapless students like me -- who were lied to at every level, including by the hospital"s human resources lying bitch. Who put everything on the line for years, only to discover we'd been conned.

Or you can blame & punish the professional liars, con artists & grifters

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Get Real's avatar

Wow Mary. You have opened my eyes to something I have to admit I knew nothing about. Now I feel bad that I have looked down on the kids who did not do their homework and try to learn about the job prospects of the field they were thinking about going to school for. If the information they find is a pack of lies and exaggerations then that's a horrible situation. You put a lot of work into your comment, and I for one appreciate it.

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Surviving the Billionaire Wars's avatar

Thank you.

I cannot express how much this topic pains me.

It also amazes me how many people whose eyes were opened by the government/medical Covid fraud still believe the government & medical system lies about student loans. 🤷

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Diana's avatar

I paid mine off 10 years ago. My masters degree 18k. Paid that forever 74 dollars a month for 12 years. I knew the more money I got the more I would pay later so I only got what I needed for the degree by semester. The schools are at fault as well they load students up with debt or aide as much Can find they give without relevance to need.

As usually many pronged problem to solve. Students and schools both bear responsibility.

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Surviving the Billionaire Wars's avatar

$74/month for $28k tells me your interest rate was very low.

I expected to work 1 day/week to pay my loan, 3 to live & 1 more to save. Due to the wage lies plus lack of full time work & end of per diem, my payments -- which I had estimated within $3/month before taking any loans -- took up a giant portion. Worse, I had left my p/t job during the full time clinical training. I had to go back to that p/t job, but at the entry level pay. Bottom line was after sacrificing so much & working so hard for so long, I ended up making less than if I'd just stayed put.

The income based repayment program let me continue to live while the loans piled up.

Sill, I made out better than classmates who lost their homes

Now that real estate has finally recovered, I think I can finally sell, pay the loans, move to the hinterlands back to debt free.

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Diana's avatar

18k loan in the late 90s. I consolidated and lowered interest Bc had a hole mess of small loans for tuitions I paid for books etc worked thru. I don’t recall the rate but the 74 a month was more tedious to pay for so many years. At some point balance was low and I just settled it. I study accounting masters in tax state school stayed home to do it. If I had gone all out I could have owed way more but decided to benefit parents house and food and then got job and was successful.

Some people invest in degrees that won’t pay much and then load up with debt. Students need understand the debt incurred at 20 will paid into 30s and 40s and 50s. I don’t think they realize when just thinking about having a really good time.

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Surviving the Billionaire Wars's avatar

Being able to live with parents makes a *huge* difference.

My experience was return to school as middle aged adult. Med lab techs can do math, & I knew to pad all expense estimates & be conservative on income expectations.

But when all research leads to a pack of lies, how are we to know until its too late?

I started out thinking I could run through the program full time in 2 years on the last of my savings. Set back by a counselor lie, so was going to take an extra year. Meantime, never expected books to cost $300/ea. An extra $600 or so per class. Now needed extra for that to extra year & books, so changed plan to p/t school p/t work, which added another semester. During which time, prices cranked further.

Scary to find myself training laid off nurses at my p/t job, but already in too deep so now what?

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Diana's avatar

Push thru. In Spanish have a saying. Once you are on the mule no choice but to kick it real hard. Sounds better in Spanish but you get my drift. Finish what you start.

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Positively Paying It Forward's avatar

One of the faces of exploitive capitalism that ain’t so pretty.

Richard Wolff has been talking about this for years.

https://www.counterpunch.org/author/rwolff0998/

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Donna in MO's avatar

Health care is a really broad field, and agree it's not just an open season of opportunity in all positions, georgraphies and niches. My daughter in law got her Bachelors in nursing degree in 2018 and makes great money. Lived on nothing and paid her loans off in 3 years, although she also had scholarships and worked so did not take out the max amount she was eligible for. But she is in a major city, so lots of hospitals, dr offices, etc. The hospital she is at required the jab, so they lost some nurses but says there is not much of a shortage, although it waxes and wanes some. Sadly, she did not listen to me and did get the shot....but know several other nurses who have left the profession due to jab mandates; one is working as a home HC nurse at less $ but no shot mandate.

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Diana's avatar

So sad she took that vaccine. I didn’t think my job would require it. They did but allowed exemptions. I got my medical exemption immediately. My doctor agreed due to my anxiety about a forced vaccine and possible allergic reaction I shouldn’t have any vaccine Bc were forcing flu as well. So I test for about five months on and off Bc I would hide or avoid going until they said we are stopping all asymptomatic testing. What if day of rejoicing for me. No more pretending to stick swab in nose or hiding.

Vaccines should be a choice not a requirement. I prefer medical professionals that are not vaxxed Bc i don’t hear the you might die crap. I don’t believe it.

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Surviving the Billionaire Wars's avatar

Timing is everything.

My experience was 2008-2011. The crash & start of Obama's (non) recovery.

At our graduation "ceremony" half the class still hadn't gotten an interview. The program director's boss got up to cheerlead: he was sweating bullets in front of a stunned silent group. "Just hang in there for 5 years."

I had to console the young woman sitting next to me, who started crying.

One student piped up: I can't wait 5 years. I need work now.

Sorry your daughter got jabbed. At least I learned to never trust the health system or any level of government again.

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Donna in MO's avatar

I am sorry too. She is a type 1 diabetic, and so was one of the first in line, got it in February '21 (I was like please wait and make sure we know this is safe but she trusted the medical establishment) Had an appendicitis/emergency appendectomy in March. I blame the shot. She does not.

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Diana's avatar

I am type 1 and didn’t do it despite doctors telling me I would die. I attended an online conference where they said type 1 controlled had a 98% chance of surviving. I said wait that doesn’t sound like I will be the 2M to die so I said no thank you. I started to pretend to have anxiety and cried at doctor saying I know vaccine will kill me and I think I am allergic Bc of all the sinus infections etc. Oh I deserved an Oscar and my doctor I’ve known for 15 years felt sorry for me said ok I will exempt you from vaccine but you must wear. Ok I said. I didn’t that too much either.

Maybe I was lucky or maybe the shot is worse that covid. Not sure but I am glad to be shot free.

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Diana's avatar

I was already employed at a large accounting multinational accounting firm and I had days nothing to do so many clients falling to foreclosure. I though I would lose my job and I hated Obama for the slowest recovery ever. I got placed outsourced to a company in chapter 11 as a tax director for 2 years and then I started to get handed new clients little by little but it was super scary. I would have the cleaned the floors of that accounting firm to keep my job if they had asked me. Luckily I was already 10 years into my profession as a tax accountant and with hard work and pay freeze I made it thru the fall out.

Agree timing everything.

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Positively Paying It Forward's avatar

What do you mean “ the 2008-2011 Obama’s recovery (not)”. The banks and other financial institutions that accelerated the crash mostly all recovered just fine.

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Surviving the Billionaire Wars's avatar

Thay sure did. We made great foam for the runway.

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Lucinda's avatar

So Interesting. I had a small student loan to finish my last year of college and 2 years of graduate school. Jobs were not available when I graduated in the 80’s either, unless you graduated from an Ivy League school. Makes me wonder if it’s all about indoctrination of young people.

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Diana's avatar

Ivy League gets you in the in crowd. The crowd that will get you money you don’t deserve. I worked my butt off with a degree from a small state school and I do ok and Can sleep at night. I can tell you I’ve worked with Ivy League scholars I can hold my ground. The books are the same maybe the teachers better but open the book read teach yourself asks questions and I can tell you don’t need Ivy League unless just interested in schmoozing with the upper class. Degree doesn’t make the person, the person makes the degree.

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Surviving the Billionaire Wars's avatar

Yes. Not only indoctrinating, but enslaving. And for the middle-aged told to just "learn to code" into 2nd career, slow strangulation to suicide or murder by other means.

In my time frame, Obama could have forced interest rates back down to the 1% they'd once been. Instead, the income-based repayment scheme keeps you at or just below water with $$ still coming in to gov while your debt continues to grow. By the time Hillary was campaigning on replacing the program and lowering interest rates, it was years too late My debt was almost double, while salaries were stagnating under Obama's slow-walked recovery.

A young classmate went to Northeastern U, woke up after his freshman year to fact that he already had $60k in debt & no way to pay it back. So left NU, returned home to Maine & transferred into UMA mlt program. Local hospital human resources lied to him about the starting pay & range, in fact given the job a small annual raise from the year before when I spoke with her.

We attended classes together, shared notes, both were invited into honors society (he joined, I didn't) & both graduated summa cum laude.

And both woke up to the bitter reality around same time when we got job offers.

He turned to the school advisor for help. I warned him against it, but he was out of options.

Last I saw, he planned to keep taking on loans & continuing in the health care path, I'm guessing md, hoping to eventually earn enough to pay them off. He told me everything the advisor told he to do ended up making things worse, but he didn't know what else to do.

In hindsight (always 20/20) I think his best bet would have been to go back to lobstering fulltime & when that went soft, transition to elvers, which took off around then. There was enough $$ in those, plus stuff he could do off season, to climb out of hole the he fell into.

Next time you see some young md pushing the jabs, consider the possibility they've been taught to hate humanity.

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YYR's avatar

Limitless guaranteed govt money at no risk to the school also incentives outrageous tuition. Colleges should have some skin in the game. College was affordable when I went not so long ago.

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Wesley Hoyle's avatar

I agree. Again, perverse incentives. Why not hike tuition and bloat administration when there are no negative consequences for it?

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M VARR's avatar

You have an ARMY of college administrators whose sole purpose it is to sign up financially illiterate naive teenagers for decades of debt peonage.

They are greedy con artists preying on the vulnerable.

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Truthseeker's avatar

My daughter just started as a freshman at University of Florida … and I am beyond grateful for the fact that she’s in the free state of Florida.

BUT

I have to tell you… the conversations we had to have with her … as an irrational teenager… about going against the elitist New England woke college system/culture … was mind boggling

she had another student ask her where she was going to college? And when she said UF- the kid actually said to her… ‘oh- I thought you were smart.’

whereas MOST of her friends are going to pay $60,$70,$80 and even some cracking $90k a year! To go to ‘name brand elite’ colleges… the money is staggering

And The teenage brain

Is not equipped to make adult financial decisions to that extent … the money is outside the scope of their understanding now

They just think they should go to the best college they can get into … and they are being programmed to think that way

without considering cost. That’s the teenage college culture now… if a kid talks about the price tag at all… it’s because they are getting that messaging from the PARENT. And many parents are absent or not properly advising their kids … just trying to please their child… make their dreams come true kind of mentality. But not making them aware they will have to pay back the loans, details, etc. is not helping them achieve any dream.

My husband went to a financial aid lecture. She said parents are mortgaging their homes to pay for their kid’s college tuition … and there’s a staggering percent of parents declaring bankruptcy after freshman year… because they had enough money for one year but not the other years of college

Here’s a good example

A good friend of my daughter’s got into UPenn dental program… very prestigious… great education… but the total cost cracks $700,000…. 🧐 $700,000!!?

How is she gonna ever pay that back? Or buy a home?

That’s a lot of teeth to fill!!!

The whole college system is broken in this country. I don’t know how to fix it… but pretty much anything would be better than what it is now.

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Jeff C's avatar

Completely agree with your last sentence (as I'm sure most parents do) yet parents still insist their children must attend some particular college? There's some serious cognitive dissonance going on.

One problem I see is that so many kids believe they are *entitled* to go to college and mom and dad have some obligation to foot the bill. Parents then, out of some sense of guilt, rack up their own debts (like a second on the house) because they are too soft to tell their kids no. They are more worried that their kids like them, than they are about the kids learning some hard truths about life.

I put the blame squarely on the parents for this. They never made clear to their kids that they are expected to be independent and the day they turn 18 they are legally adults. From that day forward the parents owe them nothing. Any financial assistance (tuition, room and board, automobile, etc.) is a gift based solely on the parent's discretion that can be withdrawn at any time. I don't know about you guys but I don't do favors for people that think I owe it to them, regardless of family status.

I've made clear to my boys (17 and 14) we will happily help them out, but only if they have a grateful attitude and a clear plan. They are owed nothing. We will not pay for them to go "find themselves" or become "well rounded individuals" at some swanky university. They can do that on their own dime if so inclined. However, if they have clear goals and want to pursue an education that directly applies to a legitimately marketable skill, then we will help them out. They need a coherent plan though, we are not going to pay so they can enjoy the "college experience" while being filled with Marxist drivel.

There are lower cost options too such as community college for the first year or two than can then be directly transferred to a state university. The diploma is exactly the same as if the student spent four years at the university. Plus if going into hard sciences, the graduate degree institution is the important one, not undergraduate. I know little Kayden or Brayden may have have their heart set on going to Prestigious University with a good football team right out of high school (and bragging about it to their friends), but there are all sorts of disappointments in life. May as well learn that lesson early.

It probably sounds harsh but I've made it clear to my boys that if them being self-sufficient, forward-thinking, and grateful results in them hating me, then that's a price I'm willing to pay. Seriously, I'd rather them be good, strong, productive adults and never talk to me again, if that's what it takes. I don't want that, and I hope over time they would see the wisdom of my actions, but if not it is what it is. Fortunately, they seem to be getting it. We've seen what happens to a generation that thinks they are owed something and it ain't pretty.

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Truthseeker's avatar

I agree.

What you’re teaching is your family values… and that’s what’s been lost today in some families. But I do believe we must get back to it as a nation. It’s more important now, than ever.

I always loved this ;)

Shaq's message to his kids about money: 'We ain’t rich. I'm rich.'

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John Cougar Misanthrope's avatar

"They just think they should go to the best college they can get into … and they are being programmed to think that way ... ."

This isn't a recent development. Our culture is obsessed with credentials and prestige just like any society with a deeply-rooted caste system. The Ivy League and places like MIT, CalTech and the service academies were always mystical symbols of prestige, even to kids like me who grew up in an economically depressed urban environment.

As a lawyer, I know that there are law firms out there that wouldn't p*ss on me if I was on fire simply because I didn't graduate from a T-14 law school, regardless of the level of my experience or my law school accomplishments (law review, etc.). Life goes on.

The absurdity is that much of the perception of school prestige is driven by the absurd U.S. News and World Report ranking system. How a publication that is no longer in print and that no one read in the first place can have so much influence is beyond me. There's no doubt that there is a cartel of universities, standardized testing companies, and financial institutions that drive this with the losers being the students and their families who buy into their marketing. For example, the whole idea of 'super-scoring' and the common application is to encourage the academic feeding frenzy that allows 'elite schools' to brag about their 5% acceptance rate.

I have two sons of similar ages to yours and I have given them the same ground rules. Fortunately, neither seem to care whether they go to a prestigious school (by USNWR or other standards) or what their peers think. They're both secure and my wife and I have raised them to see through all of this bullsh*t.

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Truthseeker's avatar

I agree.

We are an ‘expert obsessed’ society… and we now see where that gets us.

Time to recalibrate.

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John Cougar Misanthrope's avatar

Spectator USA published a great article by Lionel Shriver about how America has failed its young. The story talks about a rock star high school student who was rejected by a slew of 'elite' universities because she is the wrong color.

The article encapsulates everything that's wrong with the illusion that American society has become. Our children are the collateral damage.

https://spectatorworld.com/topic/america-betrayed-young-mental-health-higher-education/

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M VARR's avatar

Tell your kids.

I'm not your FRIEND.

I'm not SANTA CLAUS.

I'm your MOM or DAD and I love you with all my heart and soul.

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Jeff C's avatar

Yup. Amazing how different kids are, my younger one got this immediately whereas my older one has been a tougher nut to crack but he's getting it.

None of this is new but has been known for thousands of years, it's literally raising your children using the Biblical model. It's the antithesis to everything the world tells them though, so we have to be constantly on guard.

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Nancy Brown Birkenfeld's avatar

I also told my kids, in addition to your statements above, I'm not responsible for making you HAPPY! I AM responsible for preparing you for being a responsible, and productive adult who I will not support financially for the rest of your life!

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TMartini67's avatar

In my opinion, you are an excellent parent that has prepared your children for "reality" in the game of life. This generation that thinks the world owes them something are in for a rude awakening. I think there needs to be more trade schools and apprenticeship programs

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Bandit's avatar

You mean apprenticeships that you can actually get into? That the union doesn't control? That you don't have to be related to or be friends with someone that is already in that field and a member of the union? The ones that aren't harder to get into than Harvard? Those apprenticeships?

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TMartini67's avatar

Well..i am illiterate on the ins and outs of these because I personally was not in any growing up in the 70s 80s. The only reason I mentioned it is because my daughter is working in one as an electrician's apprentice for a large company. She didn't know anyone at this company or a union. She has only an associate's degree in electrical engineering & no one would hire her in that field. I'll just say then that it has been a great opportunity for my daughter. She gets paid plus on the job training

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Bandit's avatar

🙌 You should have to work with the precious ones that went to THE Huge U! Doing their job is beneath them, that's what you're there for. They're there to watch Utoob videos, play games on their iphones, post on fakebook, come in late, and go home early. You're

older and used to working, so why should they be bothered. Management encourages it, because, look! they went to THE Huge U! You have more degrees, you have more diverse experience, you have proved yourself in the job, but they're the newest, bestest thing, so you damn well better step back and let them take credit for doing the work you did.

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TMartini67's avatar

You are exactly right..i have seen this nonsense. It's no wonder our entire system is going down the drain.

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Kim Adams's avatar

Jeff, you are a phenomenal but rare parent.

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All That Jazz's avatar

You're so right! Our generation has completely forgotten the true role of a parent. We raised (and are raising the two still at home) our kids to work, to show gratitude, and to make their own way. We love being here to help our kids even as adults, but the day they have an ungrateful attitude, or are living irresponsibly, is the day our considerable support ends.

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Susan W's avatar

My son graduated with an engineering degree from UF in 2015. He didn’t walk at graduation as he was already working at Boeing …. He was accepted to Purdue, Georgia Tech and Carnegie-Mellon but he had a Bright Futures scholarship and an Florida Pre-paid. Said he’d be stupid to go into debt…. He’s doing quite well with NO ridiculous loan required. It can be done.

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Truthseeker's avatar

In state Florida College tuition is another thing for the list- that Florida is doing better than other states!

Florida residents are lucky to live there with college age kids. Definitely.

Plotting my migration. 😊

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Kelley's avatar

Wow! As someone who lives in New England... don't let them come here! All the Ivy Leagues turned away from their mission statements long ago. There are still a few gems here but they are small and something similar can probably be found elsewhere. My husband and I both have college degrees- and work(ed) in our fields. However, we are exploring, with our children, alternatives to college. A lot has changed in 20 years.

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Truthseeker's avatar

I agree entirely

Have you heard of this? Praxis

Sound like an interesting new program for kids looking for college alternatives

- get matched with a full time paid apprenticeship without the cost or hassle of college

I can’t forward the link but you can access it at-

Discoverpraxis.com

This seems like an amazing opportunity for young kids to explore.

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Kelley's avatar

Yes, and apprentice university. Currently oldest is at a local sewing academy and wants to be a seamstress!

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Surviving the Billionaire Wars's avatar

I think it's up to the parents to start the conversation on costs. If they want to pay or help pay, great. But tell the kid up front how much you are willing & able to contribute. Guide them through the realities of how much they can expect to earn, how much it costs to live.., etc.

Even then, when everything is so corrupted, its a crap shoot.

If I had kids, I'd guide them toward self employment as a plumber or heating/repair. Anything nuts & bolts.

Really, a plumber. Everyone wants a flush toilet!

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Joe Karlovich's avatar

I would disagree with that. All loans terms are usually straight forward and upfront about costs and fees and I don’t think we should excuse students for not trying to get a grasp of what those payments would look like and how long it would take to pay off. And by upfront I mean it’s in the document they sign but fail to read or go over extensively. Saddling yourself with $100,000+ in debt for a degree is not a smart financial decision regardless of almost any field you wish to pursue. The hope is that they pass on their knowledge of mistakes to the next generation. For those of us who decided not to saddle ourselves with debt it’s hard for me to relate to anyone who would put themselves into financial hardship.

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Truthseeker's avatar

Joe-

You sound smart and pragmatic

Many teenagers are not.

I agree with Mary that teenagers have been sold a false bill of goods- if you go to college you will get a better career.

That’s not a forgone conclusion today. That ‘programming’ of our kids from teachers and

Therefore, if they have no guidance at home, they make short term decisions, expecting long term gains… that frankly aren’t commensurate to the actual paychecks they will receive. It’s poor decision making… college selection and loans,

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Get Real's avatar

Thank you Truthseeker for standing up for Mary.

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Get Real's avatar

Joe, are you disagreeing with Mary? If so why are you talking about Loan Terms? Mary hardly touched on loans except to say they were usurious, which is true. You picked out something that is practically pointless to highlight among the 22 excellent points Mary brought up. Yes kids should think long and hard about the money they are committing to paying back but if the information they are getting, upon which they are basing their financial commitment on is BOGUS, then I think you should try to be a bit more forgiving about their oftentimes mistaken leaps of faith.

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Joe Karlovich's avatar

So there again is I guess my trouble relating with blindly trusting someone I’d be having to pay an exorbitant amount of money to. It’s obviously in their best self interest to try to get you to take the courses no matter what happens to you. Maybe I’m just more guarded than most. Having a salesman for a father definitely taught me to look at things in a different perspective.

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Get Real's avatar

Joe, we all come from different perspective points. Until I read Mary's comment I was with you...was not very forgiving of the kids' lack of forethought. But Mary has opened my eyes to how lecherous the school loan system is. The new catchphrase...Informed Consent, relating to people taking the jabs without really understanding the risks, can also be applied to the school subjects the kids pick. It's another rotten life situation that is so prevalent in society today.

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Truthseeker's avatar

Bingo. You have hit the nail on the head Joe.

Having a father at home to guide you… made a difference in your life

Many of these kids have been told that education is their way out of whatever bad circumstances they’ve been born into …

And now they’re being saddled with exorbitant debt… with minimal high paying job opportunities after all that schooling.

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Surviving the Billionaire Wars's avatar

I trusted the federal government to be honest about employment prospects. I wasn't paying them anything.

And I trusted human resources at the local hospital to tell me the real starting salary & salary range. I wasn't paying her a dime.

I didn't take out a single loan until I was sure I would make more than enough to pay it back.

Funny, my father was named Joe & also a salesmen. When our jr high school eliminated tracking & recommended private school, my parents fought over it for a year. The only fight my father ever won.

His final word, "Education is wasted on girls. They just get married, have babies & stay home."

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Surviving the Billionaire Wars's avatar

With all due respect, I can do math. I estimated my loans costs in my head, to within $3.00 of what they turned out to be, & rounded up to the nearest hundred.

I knew exactly what I needed to live on.

I also was quite able to take the base starting range & estimate my pay.

What caught me -- & a host of others -- was s string of lies about wages & employment prospects by the federal government, state government & local hospital human resources.

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T Kosse's avatar

Oh come on, grow up. Take responsibility for your own mistake.

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Surviving the Billionaire Wars's avatar

Which mistake?

Believing the federal governments employment statistics? Or believing the hospital's human resources manager's lie about the starting salary & salary range?

I can't speak for your belief system, but in mine, taking responsibility means paying it off. Which is what I am doing.

Now, since you believe our government is so honest & our hospitals and medical system trustworthy, why don't you go get yourself jabbed & boosted.

After all -- millions of people have been jabbed & boosted & haven't had ill effects or died.

The ones that claim they did are probably just irresponsible losers.

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All That Jazz's avatar

That is so true! College level classes, along with the expenses they incur, should be encouraged primarily for those career paths that truly require them. And for anyone needing loans to complete degrees, there should be counseling about the future financial picture those loans will create for them. I think there's this assumption that college degrees are a guaranteed path to financial abundance and that they are the ONLY path. I literally know people who say to high schoolers (who are choosing not to go to college), "You only need to learn one thing then...'Would you like fries with that?'", implying their only option will be to work in fast food. It's infuriating. And I also think many kids would benefit from time in the real world to learn what they enjoy and dislike doing, as well as understanding what it is like to pay the bills before making decisions about college, but they are often made to feel this is a completely unacceptable choice and they would be doomed to failure, should they choose this.

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M2's avatar

Once again happy to live in Florida. They have a Florida pre-paid college program that parents can invest in so they don't have to mortgage their house to pay for college and the kids don't have to take out enormous debt. That might seem "easy" for kids but I pushed my children to put in the work and they also qualified for Bright futures scholarships and they worked through college to pay their remaining expenses.

Too bad all states don't have this opportunity. 4 years of University - $8K. Community college even less.

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Riki Tiki Tavi's avatar

Debt forgiveness for the world's population would be a better proposition. Pull the plug on the Euro Central Bank trolls. After all, DeutscheBank is now officially DOA. Time to restart--not Reset.

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

Raising $120k for the HFDF is phenomenal, Jeff! Thank you for using your Operation Multiplier powers for the good of humanity!! 🙌

I would like to nominate Dr. Tess Lawrie’s World Council for Health (https://worldcouncilforhealth.org/) as a future candidate for OM.

Yesterday, I had the privilege of meeting with Tess, Shabnam Palesa Mohamed, and Devyn (their tech guy), and we are teaming up to stop what arguably poses the greatest threat to humanity and freedom in human history: namely, the WHO’s attempted power grab (https://drtesslawrie.substack.com/p/urgent-my-video-call-with-the-who) via their proposed international pandemic treaty and the amendments to the International Health Regulations (IHR) up for discussion at the 5/22–28 meeting. If approved, the IHR amendments would end national sovereignty starting in November and give the WHO dictatorial global powers to declare a “pandemic” and force countries to submit to their edicts or suffer economic sanctions, withholding of international aid, etc. An unelected bureaucrat and likely war criminal would have the power to impose a “OneHealth” dictate that supersedes democratically elected nation-state policies.

We will be embarking on a multi-front effort focused first on stopping the IHR amendments as well as the ongoing #StopTheTreaty (https://worldcouncilforhealth.org/news/2022/03/pandemic-treaty/45591/), followed by a #StopTheWHO campaign to deal a lethal blow to this nearly omnipotent arm of the WEF/globalist agenda.

The WHO held a sneak-attack meeting a couple weeks ago and only allowed 48 hours for public comment in response to their coercive question (worded to imply the inevitability of the treaty) limited to 250 words. Here is the response I submitted:

• “Letter to the WHO” (https://margaretannaalice.substack.com/p/letter-to-the-who)

And here are some resources with more information:

https://jamesroguski.substack.com/p/pandemic-treaty

https://worldcouncilforhealth.org/multimedia/shabnam-palesa-mohamed-who-pandemic-treaty-the-pulse/

https://worldcouncilforhealth.org/multimedia/dr-astrid-stuckelberger-who-pandemic-treaty/

The WCFH’s April 11 General Assembly Meeting is exceptionally informative:

https://worldcouncilforhealth.org/multimedia/general-assembly-meeting-april-11-2022/

These three videos are excerpted from that General Assembly meeting, and I recommend everyone watch them:

https://worldcouncilforhealth.org/multimedia/the-whos-upcoming-power-grab-with-james-roguski/

https://worldcouncilforhealth.org/multimedia/global-rise-in-authoritarianism-jonathan-emord/

https://worldcouncilforhealth.org/multimedia/movimiento-por-la-salud-y-la-libertad/)

Anyone interested in following the WHO’s power grab and our efforts to stop it should follow Tess and me on Substack as we will be publishing a series of articles on how people can help us #StopTheWHO:

https://drtesslawrie.substack.com/

https://margaretannaalice.substack.com/

Jeff, please email me (if you’re on my mailing list, you can reply to any of my newsletters) if you would like to discuss more details privately.

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SM's avatar

I heard about this proposed treaty last month and was horrified to find that it came from our own government. It is absolutely absurd that they are gleefully handing our sovereignty over to foreign, power hungry, potential dictators. Doesn't that count as treason? Insurrection? Essentially overthrowing our own constitution and giving endless, unregulated authority to a foreign body...??

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

The international pandemic treaty was proposed by the WHO’s World Health Assembly (https://www.who.int/news/item/01-12-2021-world-health-assembly-agrees-to-launch-process-to-develop-historic-global-accord-on-pandemic-prevention-preparedness-and-response), but apparently, the IHR amendments did come from the US (this component is new to me as I have been focused on the treaty, but I will be researching and writing about it in the coming weeks). James Roguski has been covering this exhaustively, so I should add him to the recommended Substacks for coverage on this:

https://jamesroguski.substack.com/

I do agree that this constitutes treason and has been part of the global coup that has been underway for two+ years, but of course, it’s presented under the guise of “public health,” just like the UK’s attempts to curtail human rights for the “greater good” (https://margaretannaalice.substack.com/p/letter-to-the-uk-government).

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SM's avatar

I have been watching Dr. Reiner Fuellmich's Grand Jury sessions for a while now. One expert witnesses was from the World Council for Health and her testimony was riveting. It can't be legal for the federal government to enter into a treaty of such harmful and self destructive policies. Those who are seeking unregulated power are NOT concerned about our health now, nor will they be.

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

Thank you for the heads-up about the Grand Jury interview! If you could provide a link, I would be grateful.

James Roguski is going to appear on there soon. Leslie Manookian offered to connect me with Reiner, and I’m going to try and get Tess on there, too.

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Maureen ODH's avatar

There are quite a number of documented Grand Jury sessions. This is just one interview and link: https://rumble.com/v12ff9w-april-25-2022.html

Thank you Margaret for your extensive exemplary efforts to enlighten “we the people” of this end game global dictatorship in the name of “health” …

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

Thank you, Maureen! And yes, the Grand Jury sessions have been on my to-watch list since they came out :-) I have been watching the Corona Investigative Committee interviews since they started doing them so wasn’t sure how much they overlapped with what I’ve already seen, but I love that they’re now all organized tightly into a persuasive set of testimonies that I can easily share with others.

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SM's avatar

It is next to impossible to find a link on google but if you're on Gettr you can search Corona Investigative Committee and watch the videos there. You can watch them live right now, in fact!

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

Thank you, SM! Was Shabnam Palesa Mohamed the one you were thinking of, by chance?

https://www.bitchute.com/video/OBL4tcWJWJkQ/

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Katcando's avatar

Thank you for these links and your efforts Margaret Alice! Just getting through each work day is challenging. If not for Jeff, C&C, you and others, I would be nearly oblivious to the dangers facing us, let alone feel that I can make a difference. Truly, as a community, we are powerful; we can and do make a difference.

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

We are powerful, indeed, thanks to people like you making an effort to stay apprised and take action!

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Jacque's avatar

Wow…. Let’s get this going hopefully This can be the next multiplier . I’m sharing where every I can. I’m sure they already know but sent it to the highwire…

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

Thank you for sharing and especially for alerting Highwire! I haven’t been in touch with anyone there, but if you are, please encourage people in that community to follow Tess and me on Substack for ongoing opportunities on how to take action against the WHO. It would be great if we could get Tess or Shabnam on Highwire to raise awareness about this!

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Jacque's avatar

I just sent it to their general email and shared it w a bunch of other groups. You or Tess should reach out too.

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

Perfect and thanks, Jacque!

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JC in Ak's avatar

Wow! Thank you for your involvement in this. I’d read(and shared) Dr. Laurie’s accounting of the WHO’s very frightening attempt to gain power in future pandemic situations. It’s highly concerning. So again, thank you!

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

Thank you for sharing, JC! A major component of this campaign is simply raising awareness that this is occurring at all as they are trying to sneak this under the radar while everyone is distracted by the bouncing balls in Ukraine, etc.

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Scott Kinghorn's avatar

How would this treaty supersede our constitution? Even if we agree to it. Thank you for your work.

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

James Roguski covers this in detail in his series (https://jamesroguski.substack.com/p/pandemic-treaty), but the gist is that by virtue of membership in the WHO and the UN, countries agree to abide by these regulations or risk penalization by economic sanctions, refusal of international aid, and whatever additional forms of punishment they devise for defectors.

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Peace's avatar

Mind blowing that the U.S. would be funding the very organization that would then impose economic sanctions upon the U,S. and possibly face other forms of punishment!

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

It’s funny you should say that, Hendrick, because I just got through listening to Shabnam’s excellent Reiner interview (https://www.bitchute.com/video/OBL4tcWJWJkQ/), and she said precisely the same thing (@ 14:26):

“Who funds the United Nations and the World Health Organization? It’s us! Essentially, they’re using our resources to violate our rights.”

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Scott Kinghorn's avatar

But I thought we, the USA, were the ones who do all the sanctioning. Lol Thank you.

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Carole's avatar

To fully understand how and why we are in this untenable position, please read bailiwicknews.substack.com.

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

Oh yes, thank you for sharing Katherine’s blog! She has done an extraordinary amount of work on this as well.

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Carole's avatar

Her skills are amazing!

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

I know—she has done exhaustive research and really has a handle on the legal nuances.

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Martha's avatar

I swear, you must have a clone since you are everywhere doing everything! Question: At this juncture, all efforts I've seen seem to be directly targeting WHO. Obviously, that is a good thing, but I am wondering if there anything that can be done in the U.S. in terms of campaigns to target government policymakers/officials/departments to stop this? Or is it already a fait accompli?

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

Haha, that’s funny because AnalogMan just made a similar comment last night (https://themariachiyears.substack.com/p/elon-musk-crosses-the-delawoke/comment/6303795) 😆

I wish I had a few thousand clones! I need them to tackle my todo list ;-)

NO, it is not a fait accompli, and YES, our efforts will include calls for everyone to contact their respective representatives/government officials around the world, and the WCFH is creating graphics specific to every WHO member country that people can share on social media. I also proposed a video/photo challenge that people can take up to express their opposition to the treaty/WHO that they are excited about implementing. It’s still in the preliminary stages, so I will be sharing more details at my blog as the details solidify.

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Martha's avatar

"WCFH is creating graphics specific to every WHO member country"

Awesome!

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

I got a sneak peek yesterday, and they’re really cool!

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Arlene Katerberg's avatar

Thx, Margaret Ann for your great work, and enlightening me!!

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Margaret Anna Alice's avatar

My pleasure, Arlene!

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Leo's avatar

Great links! Thank you.

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Annette Huenke's avatar

Fantastic news! Thank you for your good work, Margaret Anna 🙏

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A Guy from South Florida's avatar

All these people full of vaccine juice and then adding more unknown medicines like paxwhateveritscalled... They're gonna have all these drugs doing stuff to their bodies and doctors/scientists will never be able to figure out exactly what's wrong with them.

People are obsessed with pharma.

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Rose Loomis's avatar

That was my thought too. People will give more scrutiny to a spear of organic asparagus than a paxlovid pill.

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StellaMaris's avatar

Yup...and remember, SAFE AND EFFECTIVE, rinse and repeat......so sad.....I was hoping for a "I was blind but now I see" moment right around now but no chance.... :(

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Carole's avatar

Paxlovid is minimally effective just like the shots and will drive even more variants.

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Jdobeck's avatar

The colleges and Universities must be held accountable for “Overcharging & High tuition costs” because the US Government backed them! Kids signing 4 loans that they not be able to pay back with a degree in which they may never find a job or it pays low. Colleges have become social gathering/indoctrination centers to produce not academics and educated, critical thinkers but useful idiots who become weakened citizens of the government! Please pray for this country and start talking to educate the masses...say when you are standing in line at the check out counter. You would be amazed at the high % of people who have no idea of their country being destroyed from within!

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Karen Bandy's avatar

I agree, and kids are prepped or dare I say groomed for this in grade school, look at all the poor youngsters who cling to their masks even when outside playing or hiking with their families. Or who won’t give them up in grocery stores.

They will be brainless robots by the time they get to college.

Grade schools have been doing a great job to prep kids for more indoctrination for more than a decade, probably two. They have taught kids that Christianity, and capitalism too, are for ignorant people. Socialism is good. And many of those kids have convinced their parents to think the same way. I have watched this play out with my brother’s family. The boys are now in their late 20’s. My brother used to be conservative, not anymore. I could go on and on, but wont.

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Arlene Katerberg's avatar

Totally agree, Joyce. Colleges/universities have much of this messy responsibility!!

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Paul Ashley's avatar

"This week, Moderna and Pfizer both asked the FDA for expanded EUAs for the jabs in kids over 5."

Repeat after me: There. Is. No. Emergency!

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StellaMaris's avatar

They are too busy repeating SAFE AND EFFECTIVE, SAFE AND EFFECTIVE.....lol!

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Elaine H's avatar

Student loans. That’s a hard one, Jeff. Maybe suits should be brought against universities and colleges so they have to give a good faith estimate of what certain degrees will rack up. I have two grandchildren who have racked up mounds of student debt and are working in non-related jobs for much less than they were told their degree would offer. They’ve been told the only way to a higher paying job is to get their masters.

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Janet's avatar

I’d tell my kid now to be a plumber.

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Julie's avatar

Or electrician

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Janet's avatar

Even better. The apprentice programs. But the unions caved and required jabs or constant testing in the apprentices. Still happening here.

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TMartini67's avatar

My daughter is doing the apprenticeship program. She went to college and got an associate's degree in electrical engineering. Every job she applied for wanted at least a bachelor's degree & 5 yrs experience. Needless to say, she ended up working at places like Wal-Mart & house cleaning services because she wants to live on her own. She was disgusted that she went to college for a degree she couldn't even get a job doing. She eventually found a company in her area that hired her as an electrician's apprentice. So she is working on the job under a licensed electrician on a construction site wiring houses. She loves it. How else will these young people get experience unless they actually do it everyday? She is the only young woman there, but she works her butt off. In her spare time she has been learning how to operate backhoes, etc. She grew up on a farm and learned to drive a tractor & bobcat at a very young age. She helped her grandpa cut & bale hay. I'm proud of her determination to make it on her own. I agree there needs to be more apprenticeship programs

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Janet's avatar

I honor her determination snd how you raised her. 👍🏻👍🏻💪🏻 She kept at it.

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TMartini67's avatar

Thank you. Yes I have to say SHE did it all herself. Luckily here in Tennessee, not all workplaces are mandating jabs. Her workplace didn't. No daily testing, no masking. No one "helped" her get the apprenticeship job. She is the only woman there so that may have been a reason she was given this opportunity? I know Bandit made a comment about these apprenticeships & trade schools that are union controlled & are harder to get into than Harvard.. I had no idea about that. My daughter didn't run into any of that..maybe luck I don't know

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Mary H.'s avatar

Absolutely!! College degrees are not for everyone.

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Mary H.'s avatar

Our country is in need of tradesmen; electricians, plumbers , construction etc.

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Roger Beal's avatar

Yep. Attend Mike Rowe's College of Useful Learning.

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Arlene Katerberg's avatar

Or electrician or carpenter or-.

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VeryVer's avatar

I wish I was a plumber.

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George Gillson's avatar

First rule of plumbing: shit flow downhill.

I forget the second and third rules.

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Arlene Katerberg's avatar

LOL!!!

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Arlene Katerberg's avatar

Never too late!

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JustANobody's avatar

Same here with my grandson!

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User's avatar
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Apr 29, 2022
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Janet's avatar

Yes. I was just thinking of that because of the last bill we got. 😵‍💫

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Katcando's avatar

Someone makes money from HVAC but not necessarily the residential guys who come out. Small companies don't get automatic cost-of-living raises or any type of bonus.

My sons did strictly HVAC and after a mix of residential and commercial work have moved into other jobs.

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Jeff Childers's avatar

Yes, this

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Janet's avatar

Heck. The guy or gal twirling the stop and slow sign on our road repair crews makes more than most college grads these days.

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VeryVer's avatar

College is just a big pyramid scam now. Just a way to funnel (launder?) tax money to colleges and loan servicers through the "student loans."

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Rose Loomis's avatar

I have an art history degree - seriously. Think I ever worked in art history? Nope. But then again I paid my own way all the way through college. Luckily I got a masters degree in a useful topic (MBA). Paid cash for that too by working 2-3 jobs since I was 12 years old.

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Ray's avatar

doctors seem to spend their entire careers in various states of bafflement

i remember when they were baffled that i reversed my diabetes but when i told them how by doing keto they said ooh thats dangerous!

ive never been healthier and havnt been near a doctor for anything other than a blood test since

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CitizenA's avatar

I was able to stop my blood pressure meds and now have normal blood pressure after going keto. Also resolved my severe hypoglycemic (low blood sugar) episodes which would drop to the upper 40’s to lower 50’s mg/dl😳! …And that I was experiencing at least 3 times a week have all stopped, and stay in the normal range.

And this happened quickly, like after 2 months of going full keto. Also lost 39 pounds. I think carbs and sugars are a big part of many of our diseases today, as well as we don’t eat the right kind of fats. I consume lard, olive oil, avocado oil, and almond oil.

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Ray's avatar

great work, now if we can just get doctors to stop prescribing junk science and do what we did it would save millions of lives

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Fortified City's avatar

Thanks again Jeff Childers.

Yes indeed our founding fathers of the Constitution were extremely discerning and wise to follow after the governing principles God established, remembering the year of Jubilee when everyone got a reset.

However, It is clear that in order to truly solve our problems we must strike at the root of those creating them.

This horde of creeps must be removed otherwise we’ll be running around putting out fires on and on.

This illegitimate regime can’t solve any problems they may have inherited such as our catastrophic student loan “program”.

They’re only concerned with creating creating conditions of chaos and destruction for its quite obvious wealth distribution is their ultimate goal, destroying the backbone of America the working middle class.

I’m looking for a trigger someone or some event that will succeed in igniting the seething anger of 75% of the population. Who I believe are God honoring, family loving patriots who want nothing more than to be left alone to live in freedom.

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Anne's avatar

I suspect a collapse is more likely than the revolution you're looking for. If what's already happened hasn't stirred a critical mass of people, I don't know what will. This regime has taken people's wealth, security, hope for the future, bodily autonomy, health, and children. What's left to do to make them angry? Maybe the information control is too much to overcome. Maybe we're too comfortable. If there does come a collapse, maybe something good can eventually come out of that upheaval, but it'll be hard to get there through it.

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TC's avatar

Student loans are such a racket. I used to work in higher Ed and saw so many lives made harder by student loans. The one thing the Obama administration did right was to crack down on for profit schools and force them to show outcomes for their students (that is to say Jobs) in order to be able to offer federal loans to students. Not just empty promises. That was one policy I was sad to see go when trump took office because there was nothing else put in its place. Sadly these types of institutions (and it’s not limited to them by any means - colleges are creating so many Masters level programs because they are cash cows) target veterans because of their GI bill. But what happens when these people who are not prepared for college start attending a crap school that gives them no support and they flunk out? They don’t have a degree yet they still have the debt and not enough of a balance left to try starting over at another school. (Your federal student loan amount has a lifetime limit) Yes I agree that personal responsibility is part of the equation but so many of the people this loan program hurts are first generation college students who don’t typically know what to look for in a college. They think degree = job but there are a bunch of steps in between that they don’t know about. So many institutions prey on that and it makes me so mad.

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VeryVer's avatar

So right. I started college in 1988 and had no clue and no money. I was a nerdy student in high school and everyone in my family thought I should "go to college." None of them had been to college. I had asthma and couldn't join the Air Force. (The recruiters basically laughed at me. I don't blame them, looking back....) I made all the mistakes possible, stepped in all the traps...but who set these traps? Why are they even there?

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M VARR's avatar

The one thing the Obama administration did right was to crack down on for profit schools and force them to show outcomes for their students (that is to say Jobs) in order to be able to offer federal loans to students.

He should have audited the outcomes of the profitable "non profit" schools.

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Martha's avatar

Exactly! Makes me think the intended outcome was to eliminate/hurt the for profit schools, which are typically trade schools.

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LMWC's avatar

Great C&C again. Unfortunately for Michigan families with college students, the Governor will veto anything the Legislature does on prohibiting mandatory jabs for college students. There ought to be a law setting a high watermark on how often a Governor can use veto power in a given year. Ours must hold some kind of record. I think she issued 137 vetoes in the first year of covid. I didn’t count after that. She will only negotiate on budget monies and will generally get her way against a Republican led Legislature who continually tell their constituents, “nothing we can do.” A mirror of DC is this bunch. But our eyes are open now and we are fighting back!

Why oh why are these ‘people’ testing when they have no SYMPTOMS? There is no such blooming thing as asymptomatic! And I wish some of the medical profession would have the guts to say it out loud. I am still amazed at how I can attend almost any sporting event, indoor entertainment now and not see a mask, but go into any large retailer/superstore and they are still dotting the landscape. 🤦‍♀️

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Natalie's avatar

We really have to get rid of Whitmer! Some are actually talking about her running for president in 2024! I hope that after the FBI-planned Whitmer kidnapping debacle, that dream will die.

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Nicki's avatar

We do have to get rid of Whitmer - she should have been booted a year ago. Let’s hope people make smart choices at the polls this fall.

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Kitkat's avatar

We have the same problem with Gruesome Newsom in Cal. Sadly, with Dominion voting machines and now only mail-in ballots, we are forever doomed by election fraud.

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Arlene Katerberg's avatar

We tried.

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Nicki's avatar

We did indeed.

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Arlene Katerberg's avatar

Totally agree, Natalie!!

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Kenny B's avatar

Ya know, Isn't the vp of the US triple boosted, and taking PAXlovid? why isn't she on Redemsivier? (sp)

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LMWC's avatar

I believe it’s basically the same thing. Why are these all 5 day doses? I know too many people who took Remedesivir and it prolonged symptoms or killed them. I feel like my husband dodged a bullet when I wouldn’t allow it for him. What happened to the monoclonal antibodies, (that he wasn’t allowed)?

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Karen Bandy's avatar

I know you know what happened to monoclonals, Biden or his handlers took them away, uh, cuz they work? As you also know, we live in a clown 🤡 world. So happy your husband survived and you were strong! Yes!

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KB's avatar

They're now disregarding demands to bypass Remdeathesvir. Check out protocolkills.com

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Martha's avatar

It will be interesting to see if she ends up with a worse case of COVID...

The Igor Chudov article cited by Jeff:

Paxlovid, "Snake Oil" of the 21st Century?

https://igorchudov.substack.com/p/paxlovid-snake-oil-of-the-21st-century?

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Lisa P's avatar

Jeff, you didn't mention this tidbit, so I'm assuming you are unaware.

"In 2005, the Bankruptcy Abuse Prevention and Consumer Protection Act (BAPCPA) made all educational loans, public and private, nondischargeable absent a showing of undue hardship (an impossible standard to meet as interpreted by courts across the country)." This bill was heavily supported by... you guessed it - Joe Biden. https://www.natlbankruptcy.com/make-student-loan-debt-dischargeable-in-bankruptcyagain/#:~:text=In%202005%2C%20the%20Bankruptcy%20Abuse,by%20courts%20across%20the%20country).

The change to the bankruptcy laws helped fuel the flood of loan marketing and giving to students, which led to higher tuition costs, which led to colleges competing for students, thus the building of non-educational things like lazy rivers and rock-climbing walls.

After 5 years of college, in 1998 I had about $20,000 of debt (and I never went to Panama City for spring break). I have an engineering degree and got a good job, lived a mostly frugal life for several years, made extra principal payments every month and paid it all off in 5 years. People who make mistakes have to learn from them, sometimes the hard way. That's what builds character and leads to better future decision making.

I agree with you that the solution is to change the bankruptcy laws. There is no moral hazard in doing that, and debt forgiveness will lead to more irresponsible borrowing (a lot like amnesty would lead to more illegal immigration). The real problem is that the Democrats never met a moral hazard they didn't like.

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Neil Kellen's avatar

ADE is real.

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UM Ross's avatar

"Comanche warrior Elizabeth Warren"

How dare you mis-tribe her like that. She's Cherokee, not Comanche! :P

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George Gillson's avatar

No diatribes please!

; )

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Bubblehead's avatar

Neither Cherokee nor Comanche! Powhatan is Pocahontas! After all, we must remain historically correct and I recall that her name is "Pocahontas"

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JW's avatar

Anyone catch Biden's "kleptocracy" speech. He is getting worse by the second.

https://youtu.be/lKChUaLmqLk

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VeryVer's avatar

Paxlovid doesn't work either, then? lol. Pfizer is just wheeling any old "drug" out of the warehouse to sell at this point. "Does it work?" "Maybe, define, "work.""

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JW's avatar

They are probably just renaming the same drug over and over and peddling it until their stock is gone. Once it is found to be ineffective they just put a different color lipstick on it and try again.

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M2's avatar

Isn't there a saying about lipstick on a pig? :)

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JustANobody's avatar

Lots of comments about people actually becoming sicker after 5 days and ' testing' positive. Saw it on another substack.. I think Dr. Alexander.

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VeryVer's avatar

Stay far, faraway from anything Pfizer is selling....

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