For a true study, check out the Reformation period from the Catholic viewpoint. Much of what your speaker is saying is simplistic and not accurate.
Henry VIII declared himself head of the Church of England because he wanted to divorce and remarry. Catholics were persecuted to the point of being stripped of their property and even their li…
For a true study, check out the Reformation period from the Catholic viewpoint. Much of what your speaker is saying is simplistic and not accurate.
Henry VIII declared himself head of the Church of England because he wanted to divorce and remarry. Catholics were persecuted to the point of being stripped of their property and even their lives.
The above wrote well researched historical fictions about the sufferings of Catholics.
The Catholic Church is the church established by Jesus Christ. In his great mercy, it is obvious to me that he works through the Protestant and Orthodox branches of Christianity.
But the Truth is complex and requires a full study of how we’ve arrived at this point in time.
Not true.. Jesus did NOT establish the Roman church. Read the book of Acts, and Paul's epistles. Yes, read them yourself.
His followers had to scatter because of persecution by the Jews in Israel, and the Roman governors in Israel as well. Between the Zealots and the Romans working in cahoots, christians fled in droves. BUT this was Gods plan, to bring the gospel to the rest of the world. Asia Minor was the main centre fir believers, who lived alongside if the local pagan idolworshippers, often suffering persecution. After the Romans uterly destroyed Jerusalem and its temple, there WAS no more Israel. Over the next couple hundred years once the last Roman Emperor was gone, Rome became a centre for many believers, and Rome became a centre for church leadership. Once Constantiine made Christianity the state religion (in 325 I believe) of what was lef of the Roman Empire, Rome became the centre for the church. Couciles and getheirns mostly took place there. Over time stagnation and corruption cretp in, Rome became the central office of the organisation. This, of course, let do corruption aas the central function if the faith fell by the wayside. As the "organisation" spread and grew in influence and power it became what is now the Roman Catholic CHurch. Take a hard look at the current "pope" and tell me if this guy is truly cincernted with the values and mission Jesus gave His church.nThe corruption nd apostasy of the leadership has only increased over the centuries. CHiuch of England did come about because Henry Eighth refused to obey God's law prohibiting divorce and remarriage. His fight waas not with the pope, but with Jesus Himself. So that "granch" of the church has its roots in corruption and rebellion.
When Jesus said to is servant Peter "you re Peter and upon this rock (a play on Peter's name, whcich means rock) I will build MY church" He was not making Peter any sort of prelate or kingpin. The "rock" he was calling the fundation was the faith exhibited by Peter at that time. That sae faith is in all of us who believe in Jesus. The roman church is so corrupt there is no way it can be "the trie church". besides, that leaves out all the other "breanches: of Christ's church we have seen in the past, and present: coptic (Egypt, Ethiopia, etc(, Syrochaldean (India) Russian Orrhodox, Greek Orthodox, Greek Orthodox, most of the so-called "protestant" and reformed churches. al
l trace their roots back to the original CHurch esus established "upon this rock".n
The roman church is based upon following arbitrary manmade rules, the political/performance, traditions, and, of course oddles of money/influence. I kniwm as I was raised in that church, having atended catholic schools fri kindergarten through university. I found it all empty and pwerless to deal with the confusion and emptiness and uter failure to deal with the obvious sin beseting my life. That was 1947 to 1974. From 1974 to now I have had a close walk with the Jesus who did die for ME... and ha scalled me to follow Him.
Yes, true. I have a personal relationship with Jesus. I have read the book of Acts many times and have a broad understanding of the history of the church from the beginning.
I read long ago, maybe it was Gibbon ... that the early Church was infiltrated by members of the Roman aristocracy who had nowhere else to go; and that by the 3rd century AD the word 'pope' began to be seen in use. Today, the Bishop of Rome, Pope and head of the Roman Catholic Church, the , is also honored with this title of highest honors, Pontifex Maximus. This was also the same title used for centuries in designation of Rome's highest priest. The title literally appear to meant the highest or supreme bridge builder (pons/bridge + facere/to make + maximus/supreme, highest).
Your understanding of Peter and the rock is same as mine. And your observation of Jesus/I am the way appears to be further illumination buttressing. And the Church created of God is the Kingdom, not of this world. I.e, not a building, city ... not Man ruling over men. It is a far greater and more splendid creation.
"pope" is an anglicisation of the word "papa", "father" in english. But GOD os thee Father of us all, per HIS words. Right?
You are on he mark with "pontifex maximus", ltin for "supreme bridge builder". This title arises from the lie that the pope is the "vicar of Christ on earth","vicar" meaning go-between" or " place-holder". Jesus has clearly stated HE is the Mediator between God and man, there IS nor can there be another. In my own life, having that middleman cut out of the equation made an YUUUUUGE Difference. I am now in a direct one to one relationship with the Maker and Sustainer of the universe. I know I have His ear, at any moment. And He has MY ear as well. ONLY HE has paid the price to stand between the Father and me.
WHO needs an ersatz overpaid hireling who does not even know any of we wee peons even exist? I will take the One who KNOWS my name, is closer than a brother, and gave His all.. for ME.
Your last sentence seems to sum it all up pretty tidy-like. And all the Confessions of Faith from the Reformation agree with you. And thanks for taking the time. Gloria in excelsis Deo
At a very minimum, I think you might admit that it was far easier to find things once upon a time in the days of the Wild West Internet. Much harder it is today with the control search engine censoring and with the god-Cretin Rulers trying to clamp down on everything.
Thanks for the information which I shall review. In your indite, I find it wholly astonishing that found a single lawyer admitting that you were right in the pertaining history. I never had a lawyer admit to anything, mostly just not contesting, or merely dancing around at the edges. And as you know not denying, non-rebuttal of a claim is a kind of default admission. That is, what is not rebutted stands as truth in law. At any rate, lawyers play a cagey game and live in fear of the BAR.
I think it is safe to say that the American Republics ended with the conclusion of the War Between the States. And that the year 1913 pounded the remaining raised coffin nails flat down into the wood. And that 2001 marks the rise of the Terror Empire American ... but not of, by and for the people. Everyone is living in Wonderland and know it not. The Cretin Tyrants, the Overlord Monsters, are correct in their view as the people being nothing more than livestock to be farmed ... sadly so. Regarding this state of affairs, Hosea 4:6 sums the state of things up pretty cogently, that 'my people are destroyed from lack of knowledge'. That would be first knowledge of God wherein fear of God is the beginning of wisdom. But it is all, by appearances and habit, a lack of knowedge of just about everything. We truly live in the Age of the March of the Zombies.
Manta used to lay everything out, and with each branch, agency, sub-agencies a separate incorporation. The last I saw was the County of Roanoke in Manta, and saying something like 'doing busines as a private company'. I think this all has been mostly scrubbed from Manta. They the powers that be apparently do not anyone knowing anything. And so, Scrub-a-Dub is the tune 'they' sing.
I don’t doubt a word of that. I’m just thinking of that old hymn, Leaning On The Everlasting Arms. That’s all I know to do in this long and weary storm.
It may surprise no one that a Protestant by Westminster Confession standards will differ greatly from the many conceptions as are held by the Church of Rome. One of these being that God instituted His catholic Church universal belonging to Him alone … and not to some other large ‘C’ institution made of Man and located somewhere in the middle of Italy. Catholics and Protestants will contest this contention until the cows come home as will they argue such other things as the alleged validity of the ‘apostolic succession’.
Henry VIII was not much of, if at all, a Christian. And even the duller knives in the drawer ought to be able to figure out that Henry was more interested in self-serving instruments, actions and proclamations coming with high propaganda value attached than he was about placing Bibles into churches.
That you zero in on Henry in upper case fashion is cause for puzzlement. And ditto as to persecutions no matter who of Man is doing the persecuting for whatever reason or reasons. To wit, the subject matter at hand is Protestant history, specifically Martin Luther and the 95 Theses, and with this being the launch point of the historical Protestant Reformation.
That you allude to everything but Luther and the 95 thesis appears to carry with it the risk of being seen as being more diverting of gaze than being interested in the subject matter at hand.
My zeroing in on Henry the wife killer was to point out that many notable Catholics were martyred during the reformation period, as well as plenty of commoners.
It’s not a one sided story, by any means when it comes to martyrdom.
The actions of Martin Luther were an excuse for power mad beings to make war on Catholics.
Henry, no Boy Scout, for sure and was Christian in name only. And for sure, Henry-clones abound in our day. And for sure Luther was embraced by the Northern European rulers as a way to get out from underneath the dictate of the Popes. Just the same as the Americans wanted out from under the dictate of Geo. III. And BRICS Plus want out from underneath the horrors of the American Empire gone Satanic Marxist Woke.
And even the Satanic Wokies don't wish to be oppressed by Christian morals and constraint in their dream of and their drive towards their One World Hellhole vision of bliss. Yesterday's C & C Rachel Mad Cow clip was very revealing of the point.
Have you looked at Martin Luther’s earliest efforts to make a religion? It is much closer to Catholic than anything Protestant today?
And his removal of Holy Scriptures and the embarrassment of having to replace them?
He’s not the idol you believe him to be. But God is gracious and merciful and works with those who earnestly seek Christ. I don’t get too wrapped up in Catholic, Orthodox and Protestant divisions. I look for the commonality.
Willing Spirit! Please be careful of presuming too, too ... way too much. The item was about church history, not about Lutheranism per se. And as regards Luther, I would say that Luther is decidedly a person of interest, historically significant, and a remarkable fellow ... objections notwithstanding. And like the Apostles, highly imperfect as are all of Man.
Your comment about commonality has great merit, and yet difference count. After all, with differences being a discriminative mental process, this is key to how we learn. That is an apple is not a pear, an orange, an ant or snail and so on. And sameness is categorization, taxonomy and the like. All in its proper placement! Both differences and sameness are required.
But I am glad you wrote as you did. People should know who was the historical Martin. I imagine that his wife had a handful on her hands. But she must have been a gifted woman as she navigated between the shoals of the mercurial Luther without undue wreckages.
The older I get, the more I relate to the book of Ecclesiastes. There is nothing new under the sun and all our knowing is so much hot air and I throw myself upon the mercy of my creator and beg His covering protection.
Enjoy your intellectual exercises. In 73 years I’ve done my share. Listening to both sides of every argument is necessary, otherwise the first account you hear sounds right.
Proverbs 18:17.
I love Jesus with all my heart, mind and soul. I’m too tired for the bickering.
Ecclesiastes is my favorite book of the Bible. It took me a long time to appreciate 'vanity of vanities' ... and harder for young people full of themselves to do so. And then next the Psalms and Proverbs (and maybe these should be first, but then again we all have our quirks)
I like Jonah who went to extremes, to the ends of the earth just to avoid his 'assignment'. And then decided that one cannot escape God if God really wants something out of us. And then after the whale and all the doings ended up under the withered palm tree, or whatever it was. And just goes to illustrate what I have learned of life. Nothing ever goes quite as one would think. Nothing! I could have never pre-imagined out my life in advance.
And then Jeremiah. Did everything right, got thrown down a well ... an yet everything turned out all right in the end. Still, incredible how much wax people can have in their ears, and how off the rails to the beat of the wrong drummer humanity can be, or more typically is.
And Job? What a wonderful book. What a lesson in Faithfulness to the Lord. The resoluteness is simply beyond description.
The Ro.an Church WAS NOT ESTABUSHED by YESHUA. HE was known as "the WAY" and HIS followers were know as followers of the WAY. . HE was a JEW. Born a Jew, lived as a Jew and died as a Jew. HE practiced GOD'S laws. You want to talk about persecution talk about the inquisition carried out by the Roman church. You need to do research for the truth.
Carolyn, the Inquisition is a very complex subject. Most Americans and English have a cartoonish understanding of it. For context, Fauci killed more people in a couple of weeks than were sentenced to death in 500 years.
This was also a propaganda war at the time. Did you hear about the thousands of Catholics that were killed by the Germans, Dutch, and English? Didn't think so. Funny, how they leave that out of your history books. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmhdYHflBDI
For a true study, check out the Reformation period from the Catholic viewpoint. Much of what your speaker is saying is simplistic and not accurate.
Henry VIII declared himself head of the Church of England because he wanted to divorce and remarry. Catholics were persecuted to the point of being stripped of their property and even their lives.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Hugh_Benson
The above wrote well researched historical fictions about the sufferings of Catholics.
The Catholic Church is the church established by Jesus Christ. In his great mercy, it is obvious to me that he works through the Protestant and Orthodox branches of Christianity.
But the Truth is complex and requires a full study of how we’ve arrived at this point in time.
Not true.. Jesus did NOT establish the Roman church. Read the book of Acts, and Paul's epistles. Yes, read them yourself.
His followers had to scatter because of persecution by the Jews in Israel, and the Roman governors in Israel as well. Between the Zealots and the Romans working in cahoots, christians fled in droves. BUT this was Gods plan, to bring the gospel to the rest of the world. Asia Minor was the main centre fir believers, who lived alongside if the local pagan idolworshippers, often suffering persecution. After the Romans uterly destroyed Jerusalem and its temple, there WAS no more Israel. Over the next couple hundred years once the last Roman Emperor was gone, Rome became a centre for many believers, and Rome became a centre for church leadership. Once Constantiine made Christianity the state religion (in 325 I believe) of what was lef of the Roman Empire, Rome became the centre for the church. Couciles and getheirns mostly took place there. Over time stagnation and corruption cretp in, Rome became the central office of the organisation. This, of course, let do corruption aas the central function if the faith fell by the wayside. As the "organisation" spread and grew in influence and power it became what is now the Roman Catholic CHurch. Take a hard look at the current "pope" and tell me if this guy is truly cincernted with the values and mission Jesus gave His church.nThe corruption nd apostasy of the leadership has only increased over the centuries. CHiuch of England did come about because Henry Eighth refused to obey God's law prohibiting divorce and remarriage. His fight waas not with the pope, but with Jesus Himself. So that "granch" of the church has its roots in corruption and rebellion.
When Jesus said to is servant Peter "you re Peter and upon this rock (a play on Peter's name, whcich means rock) I will build MY church" He was not making Peter any sort of prelate or kingpin. The "rock" he was calling the fundation was the faith exhibited by Peter at that time. That sae faith is in all of us who believe in Jesus. The roman church is so corrupt there is no way it can be "the trie church". besides, that leaves out all the other "breanches: of Christ's church we have seen in the past, and present: coptic (Egypt, Ethiopia, etc(, Syrochaldean (India) Russian Orrhodox, Greek Orthodox, Greek Orthodox, most of the so-called "protestant" and reformed churches. al
l trace their roots back to the original CHurch esus established "upon this rock".n
The roman church is based upon following arbitrary manmade rules, the political/performance, traditions, and, of course oddles of money/influence. I kniwm as I was raised in that church, having atended catholic schools fri kindergarten through university. I found it all empty and pwerless to deal with the confusion and emptiness and uter failure to deal with the obvious sin beseting my life. That was 1947 to 1974. From 1974 to now I have had a close walk with the Jesus who did die for ME... and ha scalled me to follow Him.
Yes, true. I have a personal relationship with Jesus. I have read the book of Acts many times and have a broad understanding of the history of the church from the beginning.
I read long ago, maybe it was Gibbon ... that the early Church was infiltrated by members of the Roman aristocracy who had nowhere else to go; and that by the 3rd century AD the word 'pope' began to be seen in use. Today, the Bishop of Rome, Pope and head of the Roman Catholic Church, the , is also honored with this title of highest honors, Pontifex Maximus. This was also the same title used for centuries in designation of Rome's highest priest. The title literally appear to meant the highest or supreme bridge builder (pons/bridge + facere/to make + maximus/supreme, highest).
Your understanding of Peter and the rock is same as mine. And your observation of Jesus/I am the way appears to be further illumination buttressing. And the Church created of God is the Kingdom, not of this world. I.e, not a building, city ... not Man ruling over men. It is a far greater and more splendid creation.
"pope" is an anglicisation of the word "papa", "father" in english. But GOD os thee Father of us all, per HIS words. Right?
You are on he mark with "pontifex maximus", ltin for "supreme bridge builder". This title arises from the lie that the pope is the "vicar of Christ on earth","vicar" meaning go-between" or " place-holder". Jesus has clearly stated HE is the Mediator between God and man, there IS nor can there be another. In my own life, having that middleman cut out of the equation made an YUUUUUGE Difference. I am now in a direct one to one relationship with the Maker and Sustainer of the universe. I know I have His ear, at any moment. And He has MY ear as well. ONLY HE has paid the price to stand between the Father and me.
WHO needs an ersatz overpaid hireling who does not even know any of we wee peons even exist? I will take the One who KNOWS my name, is closer than a brother, and gave His all.. for ME.
Your last sentence seems to sum it all up pretty tidy-like. And all the Confessions of Faith from the Reformation agree with you. And thanks for taking the time. Gloria in excelsis Deo
You can read most anything, because most anything is out there to be read. Discernment through the Holy Spirit is key.
At a very minimum, I think you might admit that it was far easier to find things once upon a time in the days of the Wild West Internet. Much harder it is today with the control search engine censoring and with the god-Cretin Rulers trying to clamp down on everything.
Thanks for the information which I shall review. In your indite, I find it wholly astonishing that found a single lawyer admitting that you were right in the pertaining history. I never had a lawyer admit to anything, mostly just not contesting, or merely dancing around at the edges. And as you know not denying, non-rebuttal of a claim is a kind of default admission. That is, what is not rebutted stands as truth in law. At any rate, lawyers play a cagey game and live in fear of the BAR.
I think it is safe to say that the American Republics ended with the conclusion of the War Between the States. And that the year 1913 pounded the remaining raised coffin nails flat down into the wood. And that 2001 marks the rise of the Terror Empire American ... but not of, by and for the people. Everyone is living in Wonderland and know it not. The Cretin Tyrants, the Overlord Monsters, are correct in their view as the people being nothing more than livestock to be farmed ... sadly so. Regarding this state of affairs, Hosea 4:6 sums the state of things up pretty cogently, that 'my people are destroyed from lack of knowledge'. That would be first knowledge of God wherein fear of God is the beginning of wisdom. But it is all, by appearances and habit, a lack of knowedge of just about everything. We truly live in the Age of the March of the Zombies.
Manta used to lay everything out, and with each branch, agency, sub-agencies a separate incorporation. The last I saw was the County of Roanoke in Manta, and saying something like 'doing busines as a private company'. I think this all has been mostly scrubbed from Manta. They the powers that be apparently do not anyone knowing anything. And so, Scrub-a-Dub is the tune 'they' sing.
I don’t doubt a word of that. I’m just thinking of that old hymn, Leaning On The Everlasting Arms. That’s all I know to do in this long and weary storm.
It may surprise no one that a Protestant by Westminster Confession standards will differ greatly from the many conceptions as are held by the Church of Rome. One of these being that God instituted His catholic Church universal belonging to Him alone … and not to some other large ‘C’ institution made of Man and located somewhere in the middle of Italy. Catholics and Protestants will contest this contention until the cows come home as will they argue such other things as the alleged validity of the ‘apostolic succession’.
Henry VIII was not much of, if at all, a Christian. And even the duller knives in the drawer ought to be able to figure out that Henry was more interested in self-serving instruments, actions and proclamations coming with high propaganda value attached than he was about placing Bibles into churches.
That you zero in on Henry in upper case fashion is cause for puzzlement. And ditto as to persecutions no matter who of Man is doing the persecuting for whatever reason or reasons. To wit, the subject matter at hand is Protestant history, specifically Martin Luther and the 95 Theses, and with this being the launch point of the historical Protestant Reformation.
That you allude to everything but Luther and the 95 thesis appears to carry with it the risk of being seen as being more diverting of gaze than being interested in the subject matter at hand.
My zeroing in on Henry the wife killer was to point out that many notable Catholics were martyred during the reformation period, as well as plenty of commoners.
It’s not a one sided story, by any means when it comes to martyrdom.
The actions of Martin Luther were an excuse for power mad beings to make war on Catholics.
Henry, no Boy Scout, for sure and was Christian in name only. And for sure, Henry-clones abound in our day. And for sure Luther was embraced by the Northern European rulers as a way to get out from underneath the dictate of the Popes. Just the same as the Americans wanted out from under the dictate of Geo. III. And BRICS Plus want out from underneath the horrors of the American Empire gone Satanic Marxist Woke.
And even the Satanic Wokies don't wish to be oppressed by Christian morals and constraint in their dream of and their drive towards their One World Hellhole vision of bliss. Yesterday's C & C Rachel Mad Cow clip was very revealing of the point.
And the beat goes on.
Have you looked at Martin Luther’s earliest efforts to make a religion? It is much closer to Catholic than anything Protestant today?
And his removal of Holy Scriptures and the embarrassment of having to replace them?
He’s not the idol you believe him to be. But God is gracious and merciful and works with those who earnestly seek Christ. I don’t get too wrapped up in Catholic, Orthodox and Protestant divisions. I look for the commonality.
Willing Spirit! Please be careful of presuming too, too ... way too much. The item was about church history, not about Lutheranism per se. And as regards Luther, I would say that Luther is decidedly a person of interest, historically significant, and a remarkable fellow ... objections notwithstanding. And like the Apostles, highly imperfect as are all of Man.
Your comment about commonality has great merit, and yet difference count. After all, with differences being a discriminative mental process, this is key to how we learn. That is an apple is not a pear, an orange, an ant or snail and so on. And sameness is categorization, taxonomy and the like. All in its proper placement! Both differences and sameness are required.
But I am glad you wrote as you did. People should know who was the historical Martin. I imagine that his wife had a handful on her hands. But she must have been a gifted woman as she navigated between the shoals of the mercurial Luther without undue wreckages.
The older I get, the more I relate to the book of Ecclesiastes. There is nothing new under the sun and all our knowing is so much hot air and I throw myself upon the mercy of my creator and beg His covering protection.
Enjoy your intellectual exercises. In 73 years I’ve done my share. Listening to both sides of every argument is necessary, otherwise the first account you hear sounds right.
Proverbs 18:17.
I love Jesus with all my heart, mind and soul. I’m too tired for the bickering.
Ecclesiastes is my favorite book of the Bible. It took me a long time to appreciate 'vanity of vanities' ... and harder for young people full of themselves to do so. And then next the Psalms and Proverbs (and maybe these should be first, but then again we all have our quirks)
I like Jonah who went to extremes, to the ends of the earth just to avoid his 'assignment'. And then decided that one cannot escape God if God really wants something out of us. And then after the whale and all the doings ended up under the withered palm tree, or whatever it was. And just goes to illustrate what I have learned of life. Nothing ever goes quite as one would think. Nothing! I could have never pre-imagined out my life in advance.
And then Jeremiah. Did everything right, got thrown down a well ... an yet everything turned out all right in the end. Still, incredible how much wax people can have in their ears, and how off the rails to the beat of the wrong drummer humanity can be, or more typically is.
And Job? What a wonderful book. What a lesson in Faithfulness to the Lord. The resoluteness is simply beyond description.
Well put!
The Ro.an Church WAS NOT ESTABUSHED by YESHUA. HE was known as "the WAY" and HIS followers were know as followers of the WAY. . HE was a JEW. Born a Jew, lived as a Jew and died as a Jew. HE practiced GOD'S laws. You want to talk about persecution talk about the inquisition carried out by the Roman church. You need to do research for the truth.
You are wrong.
Carolyn, the Inquisition is a very complex subject. Most Americans and English have a cartoonish understanding of it. For context, Fauci killed more people in a couple of weeks than were sentenced to death in 500 years.
This was also a propaganda war at the time. Did you hear about the thousands of Catholics that were killed by the Germans, Dutch, and English? Didn't think so. Funny, how they leave that out of your history books. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmhdYHflBDI
As do you …