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Jeff C's avatar

Many "with covid" deaths were classified as "from covid" deaths but that's only part of the reason. The biggest reason IMO is that the US population is seriously unhealthy, racked by obesity and diabetes. Sugary drinks are awful for people as are other sugar-laden foods made from refined carbs and seed oils. People eat a softball-sized muffin for breakfast (which is nothing more than cake without the frosting) and somehow think it's healthy.

As much as it pains me to admit it, this is where the libs have exercised better judgement than most conservatives. They recognized the processed food companies were selling poison long before most people on our side. Just look at the size of people at Trump rallies, it's not good.

We focus on the horribly self-destructive actions of the homosexual/trans agenda and the vax damage, but ignore the junk food poisoning happening all around us. In the mean time Americans get bigger and bigger. It will not end well.

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CHop's avatar

I was talking with my "farm group" menonite farmer and we were surprised how many members got the shots, but they go out of their way to drink raw milk, eat nonGMO foods, and source grass-fed/hormone free beef. My 4× jabbed BIL has a whole house water filter because he "doesn't trust" what is in the water😆

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Dick's avatar

I see that kind of cognitive dissonance too. Totally organic parents — no synthetic anything, uber healthy food & packaging, even wool mattresses! But vaccines are fine!

Same with the adults. Sickly, vegetarian, masked (no longer “required) aged hippies shuffle in to the health food market for their fresh organic produce & clean products… & careful in all the other respects you mention. I know they’re jabbed — it goes with the constant mask-wearing. Astonishing! What impels this odd contradiction?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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RunningLogic's avatar

Wow. That seems like such a contradiction.

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NeoBob's avatar

Great examples of cognitive dissonance.

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devoalan's avatar

Maybe their political beliefs outweigh their common sense?

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RJ Rambler's avatar

You need to understand that besides the "food pyramid" being upside down that the more diseases we get from the Gov approved FOOD is that we also are being FED drugs that a side effect of many is increased weight INCLUDING those prescribed for diabetes!! Bp drugs, and almost everyone has high bp because they have impossibly lowered the "healthy" parameters, (ask me about a recent experience family Dr vs Cardiologist drug salesman) have MANY side effects and coupled with statins for cholesterol=stroke and heart attack!!

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June M's avatar

I refuse to take the statins because nothing I’ve seen shows it actually stops heart problems. My mom had a hard time taking any of them and granted she had a triple bypass but now they have her on one and her cholesterol is below 100 but they want it lower?!? She has other problems like BP and vertigo that I wonder how much is tied to the actual medicine she takes. I have been trying more natural ways to manage mine and had success this past Dr visit. Hopefully continuing what I’m doing plus losing some weight (hmm, how much of that is tied to health problems??) I can get is lower. Biggest problem with modern medicine is not wanting to get to the root of the issues. More medicine = more money for everyone but the patient.

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FourWinds's avatar

If we think about big medicine as a business, which it is, then if it does not turn a profit, it will go out of businesses. A cured customer is money lost. The whole thing is a scam and a racket to have lifelong customers. Aside from antibiotics to kill bacterial infections, I'm not sure pharma or doctors cure a darn thing.

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Dick's avatar

Antibiotics not needed either! Except in some acute cases, yes. But, UTI’s & the like? Much harm, little good. There are so many natural a-bs.

A few: garlic, grapefruit sd ext, Olive leaf!, most culinary herbs, especially oregano oil (strong! Can disrupt gut flora, tho’), high vit C, propolis, many many more good ones — & they blitz in differing ways, so it’s a multi-pronged attack; you can use them together. Foods, drinks, sunlight (D). Turm, mullein, lemon, honey…

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FourWinds's avatar

I'm with you! I will take anything natural and it will probably work faster and better, too. Oregano oil is powerful for fungal overgrowth, too.

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Dick's avatar

Yep! So are many other antibac herbs.

But oregano oil is powerful. I use caution, but it’s indispensable. I read that it’s good if you suspect food poisoning. If I swallow sumpin suspect, I pop one. (Ginger for good measure) Dunno if it works or if I was just paranoid! No way of knowing then, is there?

God Bless!

🕊💨💨💨💨

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Dick's avatar

Exactly the same w/ my mom. Once they get past a certain age, say…80s (or under), HMO Drs will not mention the weight of their patients. And the bp and vertigo is never associated w/ the blood thinners; the pains are never associated with the beta blockers, drug interactions or the other cardio crap the Cardiologist doles out. Never side-effects.

One by one we got Mom off them. First, nutrition & supps to offset the effects of the meds. (I used the Mendel book & others) Second, same strategies to safely achieve the same goals and reverse the underlying problems.

At first, my stubborn Mom, who loved her idiot, flattering Dr., would angrily halt any mention of the debilitating symptoms being side-effects! I finally just stopped talking & quietly set the book on the table in front of her, open to the page. She read. She said, “You’re right”. And thus began the shift. Her pains did not take long to go away. Then the blood thinners were stopped & we compensated safely & naturally. She no longer had to rest on the kitchen counter & use it as a support in navigating around the kitchen. We worked on sleep & excercise too.

As her trust in me increased, she more willingly listened and went along. 4 pieces of toast every morning went down to just 2. Added good fats (curb & sate appetite), pastured proteins, (no seed oils) and way less sugary stuff. (allowed was a couple of dark choc covered macadamia nuts—good fats, good nuts, & good, yummy choc w/out too much sugar — she loved rich deserts & everything sweet. Favorite food: bread & butter. The below example shows part of the diet I tailored to her particular likes and situation; everything in it has a manifold purpose & function.

First a m. sit down , she took an enzyme w/ real juice & coffee. while I fixed breakfast — her 2 slices of sprouted wh toast were slathered w/ coconut oil & pastured butter, ginger jam, w/ grated org. orange peel & cinnamon, served with 2 pastured eggs, fruit yoghurt & some supps. (& enzymes, pre- & probiotic foods) 👆🏼Just an example: All food ought to be seen as EITHER healing or damaging. Forms matter immensely. There’s way too much to relate — so much to learn!!!

But, she began to get stronger and to drop weight. There were other health issues too, and it gets complicated to relate how we also addressed them. But the improvements her overall health and well-being was great for us both to see.

A very careful approach is necessary. The drugs often have to be stopped slowly — in the proper way, incrementally. A weaning period (consult w/doc). They all have various half-lives as well. So it’s imperative that one reads everything available on everything. Interactions are very important, too. This includes many food & supp interactions, too.

I encourage you and your Mom to continue and to never let the b….rds get you down.

It’s not easy.

But 1) undo the harm

2) Do no harm

3) Heal.

A good Functional or Integrative MD can be a Godsend!

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Peace's avatar

What is the Mendel book you refer to? Your mom is blessed with your guidance.

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Dick's avatar

Thank you! That began over 10 years ago. Mom’s gone now.

But it was a great blessing to me to have that time with her.

I apologize. It is MINDELL, Earl. A book called “Prescription Alternatives” https://www.amazon.com/Prescription-Alternatives-Hundreds-Prescription-Free-Remedies/dp/0071600310

It’s old now, but still a immensely helpful — invaluable. Well-organized & foundationally informative & a great starting point for web searches.

Amazon has copies. The newest (>decade old) edition is there —

Peace, Peace!

✝️🙏🏽🕊💌

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ConcernedGrammy's avatar

Just think about why doctors warn against eating grapefruit while taking BP meds. Because grapefruit LOWERS BLOOD PRESSURE! So, why doesn't the doctor skip the meds and recommend eating grapefruit? 💰💰💰 My husband has gotten off his lifelong BP meds and says he feels better than he has in years. He took statins for s short while but stopped when the nightly muscle cramps just became too much and the doc just wanted to ADD another RX to suppress the side effects of the first.

He's done/is doing a lot of research into diet, supplements and minerals, natural cures. Turmeric with black pepper, magnesium, boron, Celtics salt and iodine are just a few things he's researched. It's crazy how depleted our bodies have become in the last few decades and we're either told "we're sick" or "it's just age".

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RJ Rambler's avatar

Hubby just going thru cancer rigamarole and they are worried about his bp!! Cancer treatment isn't enough! They want to add cardiac testing and meds too!! And the Drs dont even agree about if his is too high!! We hate everything medical!! 😭

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Dick's avatar

RJ — Please read Granny’s posts above, & mine too (some just now),👆🏼👇🏼

Also look up how they’ve adjusted DOWN several markers for high BP & other ones they test for in recent years. Embark on that life-without-the-AMA

journey.

Find a doc who knows this stuff wrt hubby’s cancer. There’s a world of non-toxic alternatives out there.

Ask your present docs for ALL info & stats on their recommendations.

The journey is rigorous in time & effort & I hope you search & can find a knowledgeable professional ally in whose hands he can be trusted.

I don’t have time now, but I will try to find & pass on what may be helpful to you. I’ll save your post link & can do it here.

Blessings! ✝️🕊🙏🏽👆🏼💌

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RJ Rambler's avatar

♥️ thank you so much! We are up to our eyeballs in reading. We've been fighting medical establishment for 35 years. It's never over.

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Dick's avatar

I know. I really do! I was blissfully ignorant for so many years, but had no issues that challenged me into the fray. Drafted by God’s often sorrowing providence & thrown right into back to back battle.

Luckily (but not luck:👆🏼) I was never one to fit into systems or institutions. Couldn’t if I tried. (My shoelaces were always tangling & I trip so I tossed the shoes & sprinted on)

Anyway, sorry if I loaded you with too much stuff. It is a lifelong classroom, isn’t it? All while beating off the harpies, paying the bills, loving the fam and getting the home chores done.

I hope you have good cohorts & also the gratification of sharing your knowledge & seeing the benefits for others.

Take care!

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RJ Rambler's avatar

I think we are deeply related. Thanks for sharing. I know very much where you've been. It's the road all God's children travel, they can't resist even when they resist. 🤗🙌

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Dick's avatar

GRAMMY! I just realized that I was calling you “Granny”. I need new glasses. But, interestingly, I had started to write it correctly because that’s what we called my own beloved long-departed Grammy, & I love that. So dumb me, I self-corrected it to what I had misread.

…Silly addendum here, but wanted to note.

Blessings!!

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ConcernedGrammy's avatar

LOL! No problem, you're not the first, nor probably the last. My given name is often misspelled, too, so it is what it is, at this point. But the default font on substack is, at times, difficult to discern properly.

nn vs mm

Grammy is what my grands call me, too!

Blessings back! 😍

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Dick's avatar

Thanks! Granny, you are absolutely after my heart!

…Was even going to use the grapefruit example as well! The vitamin K thing is another one that fries my bacon. The very nutrients necessary for healing are what can’t be eaten or supplemented because…the drugs. Don’t get me going!

But.

If we know WHY, we can begin the path you took with your husband. Break the chain. We can help others to do the same.

We know that foods (incl bevs) have differing (and manifold) medical effects both in the body and by interacting (+/-) with, counteracting, or replacing the drugs.

That book I linked just now in the post above is so helpful with sorting through all that stuff & helped me so much w/ further web searches for more info.

I’m also glad that Functional (& Integrative) Medicine is on the rise. I see in future Hospitals and nursing homes dedicated to interdisciplinary healing. The proverbial limp in and leap out! Unfortunately, I’m also seeing the large Med systems (Providence, Kaise, for example) have their “in house” alternative Funct/Integ practicioners, but it’s largely eyewash. In name only. It’s still: drugs & surgery foremost always & we’ll let a poorly educated naturopath tack on on a good diet & exercise plan to coordinate with our prescription blood thinners, beta blockers, implants etc etc etc.

So great to know you’re doing it. God Bless you and your husband richly!

——

Reposting that link here. Old but excellent as a basic resource. https://www.amazon.com/Prescription-Alternatives-Hundreds-Prescription-Free-Remedies/dp/0071600310

🙏🏽✝️🕊💌🌻

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Jeff C's avatar

I do understand that, it's a vicious cycle.

This is where conservatives made a huge mistake. We allowed our free-market principles to be corrupted into trust of big business (food companies, pharma, medical industry). We allowed our defense of freedom to be corrupted into people's right to gorge themselves on garbage. NYC implemented a tax on sugary drinks and "conservatives" (big business lackeys actually) reflexively attacked it as violating people's right to poison themselves.

Thankfully the whole Covid vax catastrophe has woken people up, many conservatives now realize being pro-free market doesn't mean multi-national corporations are worthy of our trust. In fact it's the opposite. Hopefully they'll take that thinking a bit further and realize the libs had a good point when attacking McDonalds, Coca-Cola, and the like as incredibly destructive entities.

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RunningLogic's avatar

I still don’t agree with that tax and I do think people should have the right to eat unhealthy treats if they want. But yes, we should take more responsibility as individuals for our health and know what we’re putting in our bid yes and what consequences that might have.

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Jeff C's avatar

I don't think they should be banned, but I have no problem with a tax on sugary drinks (or tobacco, alcohol, gambling, etc.) if it's enacted by the elected representatives. These things do cause societal harm, and there's a price to pay for that.

My issue is that the organizations that profit from these vices (for lack of a better word) manipulate the "liberty" people into arguing their case for them. Sugar, like cigarettes, is incredibly addictive and wreaks havoc on society. If the elected representatives want to tax that they are entirely within their rights IMO. If the people don't like it they can vote them out and repeal it. I don't think such taxes are very effective, but that's a whole different issue.

The problem as I see it, is that people have become conditioned into viewing any constraint on their behavior as unreasonable when some constraints are required for a functioning society. It's the whole issue where people confuse "liberty" with licentiousness.

We can discuss if these taxes are effective, a good idea, or even needed. But the idea that a tax on a harmful product somehow violates people's liberty is pretty hard to defend. Yet that is what's invariably trotted out. And it's exactly where the left's caricature of us as Neanderthal "muh freedumb" people originated, with some justification IMO.

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YYR's avatar

Call me a neanderthal (not actually an insult, they were very intelligent), but I am against most taxes and licensing fees. Government has an insatiable appetite for power, and taxes finance their addiction and distort markets, which haven't been free in at least a century.

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Jeff C's avatar

I don't like taxes either and have structured my finances to avoid them whenever possible. However, "sin taxes" have been around forever, they are clearly constitutional, and the idea that they violate people's liberty is kind of absurd, no one is stopping people from doing something. However, if someone wants to engage in a behavior that has a societal cost, society has a right to make it more expensive to do so.

Whether its' a good idea is a different conversation. It's an important nuance, but one that is often lost with absolute positions.

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Peace's avatar

One concern with "sin taxes" is the concern of who gets to decide what is healthy ("sinful") and what is not. You may agree with the current sin taxes, but inevitably "they" will expand the definition of unhealthy items to things you deem healthy. Some "controversially healthy" items come to mind such as butter, eggs, and coconut oil - who determines if they should be taxed because they are unhealthy - each of these items was at one time deemed healthy, then for a time deemed not healthy, then for most people currently they are healthy. But perhaps not everyone thinks they're healthy, so should they be taxed to dissuade consumption?

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Jeff C's avatar

That's why I said I had no problem with them provided they were enacted by *elected* representatives. If the population doesn't agree then they can be voted out.

And I didn't say I agreed with them, I said they were a valid measure to defray the costs of irresponsible and/or harmful lifestyle choices (aka "sins") on society.

Like it or not though, we make these decisions based on majority rule (unless they are unconstitutional). I don't agree with my taxes funding the Ukraine war but I don't get to withhold a portion of my income tax in response. If society decides an action is harmful and wants to increase the cost of doing so to discourage it, that's entirely within it's purview.

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ConcernedGrammy's avatar

I wouldn't have a problem with "sin taxes" IF those taxes were applied to relieve the "societal harm" as you put it. As it stands, are the "sin taxes" put to use to pay for an alcoholic's treatment or a smoker's cancer treatment? Where DO all those "sin taxes" go?

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Fre'd Bennett, MAHA's avatar

Nailed it.

The fake conservatives in Congress always trot out the "let free markets work" canard, knowing they are receiving massive funding from their transnational corporate masters (Facebook, P&G, big media, etc.)

I am so blackpilled on the GOP. With a very few individual exceptions, may never vote for these bastards again.

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Carolyn's avatar

The tax is discrimination..if someone has the right to decide on vaxes they should have the right to eat as they see fit. The amount is not the issue it is what is allowed in the foods and the lack of physical activity

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Roger Beal's avatar

A case of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend".

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Leskunque Lepew's avatar

Those TV commercials worked! Everyone is guzzling liquid corn syrup or aspartame and eating fried carbohydrates. Then the Medical Industrual Complex steps in.

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YYR's avatar

Mmm. Fried carbohydrates.

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nt's avatar

Metabolical, by DR Lustig was eye-opening to me !!

I had no idea a Cliff bar had 17 grams of ADDED sugar ! 🙈

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Cathleen Manny's avatar

If you read the ingredients on the packaging of all of the ‘health bars’, you’ll see they’re all junk food.

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Jeff C's avatar

Yes but they are marketed as healthy. Most advertising is seriously bad-faith as its goal is to deceive people to act in someone else's interest (i.e. lie to people that the food is healthy so you'll give them money). Once you see this you'll realize it's everywhere and never view advertising, or public relations which is the same thing, in the same light again.

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nt's avatar

💯

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Penny North's avatar

Doing the conversion, that is 4 teaspoons of sugar!

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nt's avatar

Yes! Exactly!! Clearly should NOT be breakfast!! 😳

Which is why after reading that book, I went off added sugar June 17th last year !! 🙌

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Oregon Kathy's avatar

Really, you must read labels for snack bars.

Most are truly just sugar snacks while a few have enough nutrition to tide you over.

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nt's avatar

Right !? Not quite sure how I’ve survived 5 decades of life without knowing that …🤦‍♀️🤷‍♀️🤣

I am “fit” …so I think nothing obvious to make me think about it …

Now I know …

Packaged food is NOT REAL FOOD! 😄 lol

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Jeff C's avatar

And Lustig is a proud lib, he lives in SF of all places. But on this one he was exactly right.

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nt's avatar

I know !!! I was so disappointed he teamed up with (Pepsi?) on a new weight loss drug 🤦‍♀️

But I really appreciate his Eat Real campaign for schools and his book was VERY helpful to me , in the fact that you can be a normal weight and metabolically unhealthy! So for that I’m grateful 🙏

I’ve eaten (for breakfast alone) over 15lbs less sugar since June 17th last year !! Just breakfast!!!

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ConcernedGrammy's avatar

Be sure to check all the labels on foods now - "Made from Bio-Engineered Ingredients" is getting quite common.

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Heterodox Introvert's avatar

Agree. Obesity puts one into the vulnerable population category, yes? Puts stress on body systems / compromises the immune system which can't keep up with the constant insult of stresses to allow the body to heal... Yadda. "It will not end well." Sadly true.

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Monterey's avatar

This seems like a good time to insert that I wish family practice MD's, and others, would do a much better job of telling their obese patients how it is. As in, you need to drop the extra weight and start right now, and hear all the reasons why. Those of us with obese extended family members certainly thank you for it.

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Fla Mom's avatar

Most have no advice that is helpful, I say as a former family practice doc. It wasn't until I read Good Calories, Bad Calories, by Gary Taubes that I realized the hormonal effect of macronutrients. (Why didn't they teach us helpful things like this in medical school?) Anyway, when I reduced the amount of carbs I was eating (an astonishing amount, I realized), I lost weight without trying to (and without 'needing' to, but it was very welcome) and no longer experienced self-induced hypoglycemic lows that led to eating more to get my blood glucose back up.

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Monterey's avatar

I realize that many doctors don't have a clue about weight loss. But even they would have to know that being obese is not healthy. If they would at least start there, and inform the patient of the problems of being so overweight, it would be at least something to get the patient to think.

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Heterodox Introvert's avatar

I don't fit the profile so have never been admonished by a physician on the subject. I can't speak to what is said or isn't but I suspect that it's not much with respect to what's really happening in the body. I suspect it's a canned speech. Also suspect that patients who have heard it, have heard it on repeat. It can't feel good. I don't know who Lizzo and fans think they're fooling. Well, themselves.

Underneath, personally speaking, there is sorrow and sadness. As for extended family members, I have an adult child that fits the profile. The condition is a source of emotional pain, and I'm positive that in large part the origins have to do with unresolved trauma, manifesting physically as layers of protection. Except that the physical layers do nothing to protect. It's complex. Not as straightforward as putting the mind to losing weight. The wounds are deep.

I understand your good intent. Not arguing, not in the least. Just looking at the complexity of human beings and thinking aloud at the keyboard. I agree 100% that obesity itself is a setup for a worse situation. I sure don't have answers. Every situation is different. I do have an issue with celebrating obese bodies: they are not healthy bodies. As said, a setup.😔

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MaryAnn's avatar

Have an obese (lib) friend who is losing weight on the diabetes drug, wegovy (?) She now has breast cancer but will continue with the weight loss regimen for another 6 months before starting treatment for BC because of potential weight gain associated with the cancer treatment. She is constantly in my prayers.

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Heterodox Introvert's avatar

Sad.

The good news might be that your friend isn't insulin dependent. Did you see the article @Politico Phil posted? Things could be worse?

I say a prayer nearly daily (I miss some days; some days I double or triple up.🤷‍♀️) for both the immortal souls of those who have concluded their trip to the planet in conjunction with these toxic injections, and for those still suffering in body. They have all done/are doing an immeasurable service to humanity. God bless them and Godspeed on their journeys. Especially the ones still here. Your friend, though nameless and personally unknown to me (not important, the prayer goes where it is intended), has by default already been party to my prayer.

Reposting earlier link from @Politico Phil: https://josephsansone.substack.com/p/we-are-at-war-our-insulin-is-being

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Fla Mom's avatar

The difficulty I have with presentations like hers is that even though I'm a (retired) physician, I'm not a pathologist or other laboratorian, so I don't feel like I have enough knowledge to critique what is presented. Could she be misinterpreting something? I couldn't say. And there's so much propaganda from all sides these days that I'm skeptical of everyone and everything.

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Heterodox Introvert's avatar

Very fair.

I have watched her presentations here and there for at least a year. I'm not a physician, retired or otherwise, but do have a healthcare background, B.S. level, though retired from that. Couldn't possibly converse or discourse on minutiae but have a solid, at the very least basic understanding.

Could she be misinterpreting something? Like you, I couldn't say. What I can say is that because MSM is having none of her she has aligned herself with the "side" seeking the truth. From memory, she has independently corroborated info presented by Dr. Carrie Madej, and La Quinta Columna. When I start to see the same info from different sources I lean toward giving it credence. Can I independently verify? Nope. I don't have the knowledge or the tools. It's a judgement call. And I could be wrong. Trusting my gut. It's usually right, close to 100% but nothing's perfect. 🤷‍♀️

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MaryAnn's avatar

Not diabetic; just using the drug for quick weight loss. Thank you for praying!

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FourWinds's avatar

When I go to the store, which I try to avoid, I am always marveling at the rows and rows of non-food. Most of it is pure garbage. Few read the labels. My mom, God rest her soul, taught me to cook things that included cans of condensed soup and box mixes. It was not until I was in my 30s that I started to really learn how to cook. Now I'm nearly all scratch.

You're right, American eat an insane amount of sugar, refined everything, GMOs, preservatives, partially hydrogenated whatever, "vegetable" oils and other non-food crap. It's just not food. Then we wonder why we are all so sick.... go figure.

As for obesity, it's now celebrated, don't know know? Calvin Klein ran ads with morbidly obese, unattractive models, as if that's a goal to aspire to. There's a difference between celebrating being a glutton, overweight and unhealthy as opposed to being a decent human being and not being cruel to someone about weight. Society no longer sees that line.

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ConcernedGrammy's avatar

It's really interesting to see what the FDA deems "safe" for us Americans while other countries have BANNED these same items/ingredients. . The thing these other countries have in common is "socialized medicine". They're keeping their costs down, plain and simple. I heard Americans spend double what other countries do on "healthcare" yet we're something like 57th worldwide in "health". Big Pharma gets a lot of their profit from the "rich Americans" so they sell their drugs to other countries much cheaper. That's why people try to go to Canada or Mexico to get their meds. It's also why the US does everything they can to STOP that from happening.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/dining/table-talkers/sns-stacker-us-foods-banned-other-countries-20211103-gxobzgtxvnf6pnt26ugjstmxka-photogallery.html

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RunningLogic's avatar

Well said. This is a huge (no pun intended) problem in our country and our culture and you’re right, the libs have done better on this issue (partly because many of them are upper middle class and the money, peer pressure and subculture of that group make it easier for them to have good health habits).

But let’s also not discount the Covid policies that led to a lot of unnecessary deaths even before the shots came out.

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Jeff C's avatar

Completely agree. The public health policies were so bad it's hard to to think they were not intended to be harmful. Couple that with the complete lack of common sense nutrition and fitness advice and it's pretty damning.

My point is that as individualists we should be using common sense rather than trusting corporations and government for nutritional advice. When some entity tells us eating cake for breakfast is healthy, that should make us question what we are being told. Instead people accepted it because they like eating cake.

The libs may have gotten this one right based on the stopped-clock principle, but they did get it right. (Just like they also got the Iraq War right.) This is not a defense of liberalism but pointing out that we need to constantly be questioning what we accept as truth, particularly if it reinforces our existing biases.

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RunningLogic's avatar

Yes I agree. Good points.

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